Measuring the Benefits of AGP: Is PCI-Express Necessary?

[Defcon10]

Check this article about VideoCard tec, it's very interesting.


http://www.sudhian.com/showdocs.cfm?aid=554

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[TrinireturnofGamez]

PCi-x is necessary YES.... to keep everybody RICH!...

ATi and Nvidia can get faster cards without having to invest in more expensive components... if u look at the www.firinsquad.com X-600 benchmarks... PCI-X gives more performance not  because of the extra bandwidth .. but mainly because there is a very low access time to send that data over.. and the UPLOAD bandwidth from vid card to ram/cpu is 15 times that of AGP8x.

The X-600 is just a 9600XT on steroids... the chip was just modded to give native PCI-X and the new techs like 3Dc etc... the mem bandwidth is the same.. it needs MORE power.. it pushes out almost the same amount of texels per second etc... but it is 15% faster! sometimes 20%.. thanks to pci-X the mobo manufacturers and vid cards make MONEY MONEY MONEY!! EVIL!!! EVIL!!                    

[TriniXaeno]

don't forget the power of two.

Two PCI Express on a mobo and some SLI luvin from Nvidia = 90% gain in graphics performance.

can you say whoop ass?                    

[TrinireturnofGamez]

can you say smoking power supply? and the case would need some more cooling with all that heat inside, in the old days of SLI  the temps of the air between the cards were around 50 celsius , and those were just heat-sinkless TNTs and Voodoos.. imagine what a 6800 GT/ultra would put out?

ATis cooler/low power cards like the X-300 offer a good solution..... but then you would need the Alienware PCI-x dock to work it.

http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MjEz                    

[TriniXaeno]

Voodoos generated more heat than a Nvidia FX 5900.

You could fry egg on those cards. Don't think the new cards generate any more heat simply because they are more powerful.

Infact, the most powerful voodoo card also required an external power source, so many moons ago.

Besides, once SLI is here, newer and more reasonably demanding cards will present themselves that will use the feature without requiring 1000 Watt powersupplies and liquid cooling.                    

[Defcon10]

don't forget the power of two.

Two PCI Express on a mobo and some SLI luvin from Nvidia = 90% gain in graphics performance.

can you say whoop ass?

From the article I posted, 90% gain does not sound right. This setup is also very expensive. I would like to see Nvidia's benchmarks.

http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/article/1728/

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I do not believe heat or power are issues here fellas. Performance always comes with acceptable increases in both.                    

[TrinireturnofGamez]

tru.... the voodo 5500 had like 5 processors and u could barbecue stuff over it.

 and some of the third party 6800s are coming with water blox.. no heat escaping into your case...

 very expensive solution tho.. and u'd need a system with the power to back it up.... athlon64 2.4ghz/4ghz P4 [ when it comes out ] .

 i doubt dual cards will give you 90% more performance unless you had dual procs... but if you have a nice system it would increase your performance 40-50%.... you will not notice it in more FPS.. in fact if you don't have the processing power you might get LESS fps... but you can turn on AA, aniso and high resolutions and still maintain a smooth frame rate.

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[Flippant]

hm, i dont think technology will be seen for at least a year. this new SLI thing have too many questions around it.
what happens to the pixels near the border of the 2 rendering areas with AA and AF turned on?
what about pixel shaders that are dependant on pixels rendered on the other card?
where i getting money for this?                    

[TrinireturnofGamez]

hm, i dont think technology will be seen for at least a year. this new SLI thing have too many questions around it.
what happens to the pixels near the border of the 2 rendering areas with AA and AF turned on?
what about pixel shaders that are dependant on pixels rendered on the other card?
where i getting money for this?

lol@money...


they are probably relying on very high resolutions to hide the artifacts that may be present ... maybe there will be some kinda buffer created in the system memory to share pixel data? or will the vid cards be able to communicate back and forth?.... it probably will take years to be perfected.. and even then it will be a luxery/oddity..

but i can see myself in a few years... strapping 2 cheap vid cards together.. overclocking them and getting some serious gaming....                    

[Crixx_Creww]

um sorry to say flippy buh yuh wrong there

first off
SLI is anything but new
when nvidia acquired voodoo and their technology, they took the SLI technology as well.

Sli is proven technology, the old voodoos used it, connect two and get roughly 2wice the graphics performance, including 2wice the fps .

Heat is always an issue for everything, but as someone said, yu have to accept some gains in heat and power when yu getting gains in performance like this.

And trini the nonsense yur spewing bout needing something like a 4ghz p4 to run a dual card setup is ridiculous

for example, alien ware is already using it in their alx systems, and they are running 3.4 p4 extremes or a non extreme

and its not even a requirement

silly little youngun

lol i guess you are two young to remember that this isnt new technology




the only real issue in this matter is price

having dual 6800s is gonna have your wallets bleeding

but there are already cheaper alternatives out there

your little favourite albatron people have a fx5750 pcix card out for 146
thats pretty good for a pcix card

my concern though is that i havent seen a dual 16x pcix board as yet
all ive scene is 1 16x and 2 or 3 1x pcix on these boards and they cost from 146 and up                    

[~M@kaveli~]

hm, i dont think technology will be seen for at least a year. this new SLI thing have too many questions around it.
what happens to the pixels near the border of the 2 rendering areas with AA and AF turned on?
what about pixel shaders that are dependant on pixels rendered on the other card?
where i getting money for this?

CO SIGN!                    

[coldstorm]

There is one 2 channel 16 x pci express board but it for opertrons made by tyan(ie expensive as hell). The new nforce 4 chipset which release on fall should have a board which has 2 channel but price is unknow                    

[TrinireturnofGamez]

hm, i dont think technology will be seen for at least a year. this new SLI thing have too many questions around it.
what happens to the pixels near the border of the 2 rendering areas with AA and AF turned on?
what about pixel shaders that are dependant on pixels rendered on the other card?
where i getting money for this?

CO SIGN!

LOL!!!



if you were paying attention to the maths teacher then u would understand 3-d betta..... geometry = polygons and vetrex shaders.                    

[Defcon10]

um sorry to say flippy buh yuh wrong there

first off
SLI is anything but new
when nvidia acquired voodoo and their technology, they took the SLI technology as well.

Sli is proven technology, the old voodoos used it, connect two and get roughly 2wice the graphics performance, including 2wice the fps .

Heat is always an issue for everything, but as someone said, yu have to accept some gains in heat and power when yu getting gains in performance like this.

And trini the nonsense yur spewing bout needing something like a 4ghz p4 to run a dual card setup is ridiculous

for example, alien ware is already using it in their alx systems, and they are running 3.4 p4 extremes or a non extreme

and its not even a requirement

silly little youngun

lol i guess you are two young to remember that this isnt new technology

What a bunch a jokers !!                    

[W1nTry]

I have to second Crixx crew, SLI is not new technoolgy, I would prefer to say its updated technology, cause as he rightfully stated the principle of the dual card setup was created by vood0o which in turn was absorbed into Nvid1a, so can you spell, we have v0odoo engineers updating and porting their original designs to support  the PCI technology. As for the 90% gains its actullay more like 70% so claims Nv1dia unofficially, with the full release of the drivers to support this capability they will undoubtedly baost they results. IF you wanna know a lil more about SLI, what it uses is a speciific algorithm (currently being optimized to increase performance over 70%) that effectively shares the workload between both cards. The algorithm can either be 50/50, 60/40, 70/30 etc in terms of workload all defined by the algorithm. Also a fact is that frame rates will increase as well as the ability to run the newest games (herego Farcry, DOom III, Half-Life 2) with 6/8x AA and 16X Ansio.                    

[Defcon10]

Limited Knowlege is a serious problem in this FORUM !!!!!!!!!!!!!

A BUNCH OF 5 YEAR OLDS, don't back edit or delete your posts.

Only Trini does that

That's when he post sh!t...                    

[TaC_uP]

For my part games with graphical detail like far cry have brought about the coming of pci express

I mean how many graphics cards can even put the settings on medium at 1024 x 768 resolution                    

[Defcon10]

For my part games with graphical detail like far cry have brought about the coming of pci express

I mean how many graphics cards can even put the settings on medium at 1024 x 768 resolution

Not many cards owned by the average gamer can play at those resolutions.

I dont believe it is necessary either, the fun is in the game and if you have a top of the line video card that's a bonus.                    

[unimatrix001]

well if we stay at regular old pci, it will become a hindrance to system performance                    

[coldstorm]

main reason to move the pci xpress is not for graphic cards but for pci device since pci express 1x is twice the speed of pci the system has more bandwidth to flow across bus where it is needed most since normal pci bus on today computer if near full capacity