Used-Game Market a Bigger Problem than Piracy

[woodyear99]

Agree or Disagree? We are seeing more and more games going the online pass route for revenue on used games. After seeing how popular monthly fee rpgs like WOW have gotten, I wonder if it is only a matter of time until we see popular games with a monthly fee attached?

http://www.gamespy.com/articles/108/1089088p1.html

Electronic Arts' recently announced Online Pass, a strategy that will force used-game buyers to pay to play online multiplayer modes in its EA Sports titles, is the latest step the publisher has taken to try to push back against the used-game market. And according to one developer, other publishers should follow suit because the pre-owned market has become a bigger problem in the industry than piracy.

http://www.gamecritics.com/peter-skerritt/used-games-the-gloves-are-off

The industry has lost sight of one major part of the used game formula. There are many consumers that trade their games in towards new games, and this happens a lot. That $60 price tag is a little more attractive if you trade games in for store credit towards new games, or if you sell games to friends or online for cash. For all of the outcry against GameStop, trading sites like Goozex and auction sites like eBay are just as involved in this issue that the Online Pass program is trying to put down. The industry, quite frankly, refuses to admit that games cost too much to sell in large and consistent quantities given the current economic climate. By holding online play for ransom, publishers are forcing trade-in and resale values down and this is counter-productive to game trades or resales in the first place: Game consumers need that buffer to be able to keep up with the latest games.

[TriniXaeno]

I'm with them 96.4% on the anti piracy drive but I think the line should be drawn here with the used games.

Besides, as the industry moves to digital distribution the issue will become moot. The energy being put into "Online Pass" could be focused on promoting digital downloads.

Nowadays, gamers love steam and the games bought their have zero resale value. Perfect case study for them to follow.

EA obviously has a digital strategy, you'd think this would be obvious to them.

[Arcmanov]

Ahhh...but the console makers nowhere near a complete digital distro framework as yet, so we still need that disc.

Them companies just damn greedy though.  The money has already BEEN made on that new game sale.

Why hate on the resale?

That shit could NEVER fly in any other industry you know.

Jah boy, gamers ent bet they could be bad-lucky sometimes eh... 

Swyped from another Galaxy

[Redlum08]

Ahhh...but the console makers nowhere near a complete digital distro framework as yet, so we still need that disc.

Them companies just damn greedy though.  The money has already BEEN made on that new game sale.

Why hate on the resale?

That shit could NEVER fly in any other industry you know.

Jah boy, gamers ent bet they could be bad-lucky sometimes eh... 

Swyped from another Galaxy

Well I think its going to be another two years, because Xbox Live has titles for download like Halo Reach, Bops, Red Dead Redemption, its only a matter of time that they introduce total digital downloads for new titles to nip that piracy / used games business in the bud. Issue is, companies like Gamestop have become powerful lobbyists if you can call them that, who make deals with the Developers and Producers of games to help sell their games. Its a double edge sword for the gaming companies.

[ViCe]

Ahhh...but the console makers nowhere near a complete digital distro framework as yet, so we still need that disc.

Them companies just damn greedy though.  The money has already BEEN made on that new game sale.

Why hate on the resale?

That shit could NEVER fly in any other industry you know.

Jah boy, gamers ent bet they could be bad-lucky sometimes eh... 

Swyped from another Galaxy

i disagree
game development is alot of money
devs not making money when mr cheapo come in and buy their hard earn work used...no its mr gamestop that gets that money not the devs

i agree with the online pass but i like the way socom did it

[TriniXaeno]

I'm with redlum....2 years tops.....digital download will wtfpwn on consoles just as its ripping up on PCs today.

It just makes sense. In an era of internet connectivity, digital download is a given.

And if this "used game" market is such a threat as its being made out to be, then all the more reason to hasten the move away from discs.


Blu, I see the flow this way.

Berserk buys Red Dead Redemption for TT$500.00 @ GamezPlus
Beats out the game
Berserk sells me Red Dead Redemption for $TT300.00
Berserk sells his body on Murray Street for TT$200.00
Berserk now has enough money to buy Uncharted 2 for TT$500.00 @ GamezPlus

Yes, the developers may not have benefitted from my $300 purchase of his used game (save for me making up numbers in the online community)

But my sale allowed berserk to make up enough money to buy another game.

[shivanandrs]

It just makes sense. In an era of internet connectivity, digital download is a given.

And if this "used game" market is such a threat as its being made out to be, then all the more reason to hasten the move away from discs.

+1, it also wouldn't hurt to lower the cost of console games just a bit. $60 for almost all titles, especially EA titles, thats just too much. I'm happy to see it biting them in the arse right now. I wasn't too long ago when all new PC games cost $30USD, i miss those days...

[Arcmanov]

As I said...this kinda shit would NEVER fly in any other industry.

You could see car manus coming all of a sudden to demand a money when owners decide to resell their vehicles?  Madness.

How come nobody has a problem with used-car dealers, or used-anything-else for that matter.

...and I have absolutely ZERO respect for the phrase 'el cheapo'.  I myself have bought many used games, from ebay and Amazon, simply because there was absolutely zero incentive to buy it new, save for that 'new package smell'.....and that's the point. 

If the industry would start putting out more memorable, must-own games, then gamers would be less inclined to resell them in the 1st place.


The underlying theme here is just plain old GREED.

Swyped from another Galaxy

[W1nTry]

Yal are missing a factor that looms in the background, data CAPS. It's a VERY real threat to all things digital and whether you read it or not, the large telecoms in the US are lobbying for it like Vibes kartel is trying to be accepted by 'other audiences'. With the advent of VOIP, the large telecoms are really now seeing the potential threat it make towards their traditional bread and butter and they ain't gonna sit by and watch skype take the 'food' out their mouths, not when they potentially have the power to take it out ours. Make unlimited data plans out of reach of the 'common man' (as shiv told me comcast at present in the west coast charges BUSINESS RATES, for unlimited plans aka 100+USD) and digital downloads become a burning hole in your pocket. We in Trinidad are fortunate for the most part to not yet have these worries, just keep in mind it is a MAJOR monkey wrench in the digital content wheel.

[ViCe]

@ wyatt rockstar and naughty dog is 2 different devs padnas so my point still stands..........wen berzerk sell u red dead and buy u2 rockstar not making money and u are not guaranteed that berzerk will even buy another game with da he cud go on a drinking spree

@ arc games and cars is 2 different things. Apples and Oranges. And disagree with the statement "if they put out must own games ppl will not so inclined to resell".......ppl will ALWAYS resell. In this day and age with games costing $60US i RARELY buy sp only games for this very reason. No matter how badass it is a couple times u beat it u done with it, it will get boring and predictable and u will look to sell to earn money for a new game.

VERY few games are collectibles no matter how good it is. The last SP only game i bought and actually kept was GOW3, infamous sold as soon as I2 come out and same goes for fifa games.....sell when the new one comes out. AAA or not games WILL be sold and bought used. U feel u wont see BF3 on a used shelf? or MW3?

at the end of the day it comes down to devs gettin paid for their work and last i checked the online pass thing was for the mp component of games (good ones too) and not sp games. And lets face it its not like u paying an arm an a leg for the online pass. If ppl were that interested in the mp component of the game they would have bought it new imo.

That being said i still like the way socom did it with offering FREE dlc and weapons to those who bought the game new and redeemed their "SOCOM Pro" membership code. They not gettin cut out of the online but they will miss out on some sweet exclusive dlc unless they pay $15, which is the incentive to buy it new and i hope other devs follow this route as well.

Currently with SOCOM Pro u get the 2 best shotguns in the game and a free map already. At the end of the month we gettin 3 more maps and 2 more guns FREE just for buying the game new now tell me that isnt incentive enough na
Even @ $15 to get the Pro membership if u bought it used is a steal of a deal imo considering u already have 4 maps and 4 guns plus more content down the line. Hell ppl line up for COD dlc and pay $15 for every map pack and it not even worth it most of the time.

@ w1n agreed. this is the same problem that threatens things like that OnLive service
i dont think consoles will be fully digital and the next gen consoles will still have a disc drive. What u probably will see next gen is simultaneous releases on both disc and digital of all games which i wont mind once their is a cloud storage for your dloaded games cuz my hard drive will get filled too fast

[TriniXaeno]

data caps I think is a more an issue for netflix than games though.

in terms of bandwidth consumption

@blu_vice

The point is that berserk is a consumer in the gaming industry.

Two devs benefited from the "cycling" of the money in the economy.

As opposed to just one.

Same happens in the used car industry.

What do you think I do after selling my Nissan B13 to Arcman???

I use that money to buy ANOTHER car. May not be a nissan, might be a Toyota....but at the same time, somewhere else on the island, someone could be selling a Toyota and buying a Nissan.

Works both ways. Keeps the market buoyant.  Don't you think?

[Berzerk]

wda @ berzerk selling body on murray street.....

[Arcmanov]

I actually have no problem with the way SOCOM did it.  In fact, that's the RIGHT kind of incentive to buy a game new.

...and I fully accept that there will always be resellers, which is why I used the phrase 'less inclined'.

As for comparisons to the car industry, it is just that.  A COMPARISON.
I could have substituted any other industry to make my point, which is,
that it is absolutely asinine for manufacturers to charge people months down the line for
a used item bought from a 3rd party, especially if that sale brings nothing new to the table so to speak. 

How is it that it can be acceptable for games, and not for everything else?  Am I missing something here?

[TriniXaeno]

no sir, you are not missing anything

like you first said, its just greed.

Here's hoping it doesn't gain traction