holographic cards

[kiya]

does anyone think there will ever be real holographic cards or duel disk or maby even an arena. I would be cool and would make the game that more interesting!

[New Era Outlaw]

There is a Duel Disk, but chances are you'd be laughed out of the building if you're seen with one (on top of that, it's heavy as a freaking stone and has a ton of problems with it.) As for holographic cards and a stadium....that's waaaaay ahead of our time.

[Mez]

well actually the ability to creat holographic images is here and so is the science behind it scientists can do it but its hellishly expenisive to do all that CRAp just for a cardgame

[New Era Outlaw]

Yup. Economically speaking, it's not a feasible idea. The technology alone could amount to millions of dollars.

[Gambitt]

http://www.klov.com/game_detail.php?letter=T&game_id=10124

This game's from the early 90's. It's probably not on the scale of what Kiya has in mind, or quite the same effect, but it's "holographic". With the advances in technology we've had you could probably do something a little more impressive, in terms of the visual effects, like perhaps putting a "virtual" rock band on a "virtual" stage.

Combine that with data stored on the cards themselves, either as updatable information, perhaps wins/losses owner's name  whatever,  in the form of a magnetic swipe or other rewritable media, or fixed data like a code that tells the game machine what card to load which can be in the form of a simple bar code on the back. I think both of these methods have already been used in games or as a form of storage of the game data.



You could have your "holographic" game in pretty short order, if someone figured it was worth doing, it's not really that far beyond what we already had, just a different way of putting it together. It would look small and crappy at first perhaps, probably like a glass covered version of the the "battle-chess" table from abord the Falcon in  Star Wars, but making it bigger or different is all just a matter of application.

[New Era Outlaw]

Uhmm......no. Haven't you watched the show?
She's talking about actual projection of images of the duel monsters cards onto -any- arena. Not in a cabinet or on any fixed surface. Such technology could take quite some time to develop, because there are many things to accomodate:

- Various stats for the cards,
- Animations for the projection of cards;
- Cost of development;
- The processing power of the system, which should allow for quick moves to be made without delay;
- An updated rulings database to prevent illegal plays.

Besides which, there are so many cards out now without any form of readable data on them. Even if this got off the ground with newer cards, how are you going to accomodate for those cards that came out before this? (such as Dark Hole and Cyber Jar)? I don't know about you, but I am -NOT- going to spend X amount of dollars just to see a floating Morphing Jar when I have one that cost me an arm and a leg already. I'm sorry.

[Computerman]

But even soo NEO...it would be kewl to see a BEWD get beatdown by Goat Token!

[Narcissus]

eventually we're gonna have businessmen just like kaiba who'll develop it for the pyongs regardless of cost

[Gambitt]

Boss, I never say that anyone would be able to live in a cartoon and be taken over by ancient egyptian spirits that talk english, have bad hair and be able to wear some massive pendants without breaking up they chest.

I say that you could get a "holographic" game with the cards themselves used to input data into the game, thereby making it dynamic and playable in 3d. I pointed out that the technology to do that already exists, and isnt beyond what gaming has advanced to at this stage, just that nobody has put it together in this way yet, but they could if they want to.

As to being able to do it "anywhere" there are ways that you could do that too, but it would involve a few more advancements. All you really need is a smoke box to throw up (or down) a cloud that you could project the same image onto, the way lasers are done in clubs or in concerts.

Nobody saying it would only take a man a day to put together and it could be on the shelves by nextweek tuesday.

As to what to do about the older cards, well I guess it's like asking what I should do with all the old nintendo cartridges I have. They doh work in the N64, the game boy, the GBA, nothing. But dat didnt really stop Nintendo from telling me hard luck, or millions of people from going out and buying the newer versions. I could still peeong operation wolf (well not really eh,the gun thing mash up) any time I want, and as far as nintendo cares, they have fulfilled their obligation to me.

Of course on the otherhand the corporation could allow "dual centres" to create a temporary version of the card for use in duels. It doh even have to be physical, just a man logged in as the controller who is willing to input "#12345 (purple eyes pink dragon) merges with #54321 (jar of pepper sauce)" when a player makes a choice.

There's ways to do almost anything, if we sit around and say to ourselves it can't be done then it'll never be done. Instead yuh could look at what yuh already have and say "oh snap, yuh know if I do so, and put this here, and rub these two twigs together" who knows, maybe yuh could invent the new and improved Fire TM Ver. 2.0.

[kiya]

I like your attitude!
If cave men just sat around doing nothing then they wouldn't have made fire, something they didnt even know existed but they made it happen!
If someone wants to do this they can, come on people sotp living in the past.
Its like say 100 years ago you try to get movies on dvd tough but not inpossable (ok i dont know if dvds were around then) but you get the point!
I'm glad someone understands my point of view.
thanks man.

[New Era Outlaw]

Boss, I never say that anyone would be able to live in a cartoon and be taken over by ancient egyptian spirits that talk english, have bad hair and be able to wear some massive pendants without breaking up they chest.

Neither did I. Who put those crazy ideas into your head?


I'm not saying at all that it's impossible for people to do it, but you have to look at the facts here:

I say that you could get a "holographic" game with the cards themselves used to input data into the game, thereby making it dynamic and playable in 3d. I pointed out that the technology to do that already exists, and isnt beyond what gaming has advanced to at this stage, just that nobody has put it together in this way yet, but they could if they want to.

As to being able to do it "anywhere" there are ways that you could do that too, but it would involve a few more advancements. All you really need is a smoke box to throw up (or down) a cloud that you could project the same image onto, the way lasers are done in clubs or in concerts.

Exactly...'if they wanted to.' Go up to any Upperdeck executive, and ask them 'Are you guys going to do virtual arenas or holographic projections of the cards?' and they would tell you 'No.' And, chances are, they probably wouldn't even think about it. It would cost them millions of dollars in R&D to develop such technology (and do so in the midst of severe uncertainty if it will even catch on in the first place) and probably millions more to find venues to place these things, because compact technology or even arcade cabinet sized technology is going to take a LOT of time AND money.
All of this, without a SINGLE idea of whether it's even a smart idea to do so, because people might prefer to duel on tables and so on as they always have, and use the technology for show-off purposes only.

On top of that, even if it did get off the ground, do you have any ideas how long and difficult tournaments would be to organise and schedule with them? It would run well into several delays in setting up the technology and providing failsafes. Don't get me started on if there's a power outtage.

Oh please. Smoke Boxes? How long do you think the duel would last if you had to resort to that? Not only would the smoke blow away in more ventilated places, but what about those who wouldn't be able to tolerate the smoke? Clubs do it just for (temporary) effect, what makes you think that'll even work for a duel that can last for a whole 30 minutes?

As to what to do about the older cards, well I guess it's like asking what I should do with all the old nintendo cartridges I have. They doh work in the N64, the game boy, the GBA, nothing. But dat didnt really stop Nintendo from telling me hard luck, or millions of people from going out and buying the newer versions. I could still peeong operation wolf (well not really eh,the gun thing mash up) any time I want, and as far as nintendo cares, they have fulfilled their obligation to me.

Wrong. Wrong. DEAD wrong. Do you honestly think people would just chuck their cards away because Upperdeck says play with the new versions instead that easily? The whole reason we even HAVE a Traditional format (where banned cards are allowed) is because people complained to Upperdeck and threatened to even leave the game if they were forced to not use certains cards ever again.

So, I'm sorry. I'm not tossing away any cards that I shelled out hundreds of dollars for just so I can use one that fulfills the same function and can be used on a holographic arena that I probably will have limited access to compared to what I can use at home.

And if that were to happen, Upperdeck stands to severely LOSE on sales on their previous boosters, because they may not be holographically compatible. So, no, Gambitt. Yu-Gi-Oh! cards are not like your NES cartridges, at all. Because the whole reason why you can't use use those cartridges on the newer systems is because the TECHNOLOGY IS OBSOLETE. The cards, on the other hand, were made to last as long as the game itself does.

Nobody saying it would only take a man a day to put together and it could be on the shelves by nextweek tuesday.

You could have your "holographic" game in pretty short order, if someone figured it was worth doing, it's not really that far beyond what we already had, just a different way of putting it together.

...contradicting yourself.....

Of course on the otherhand the corporation could allow "dual centres" to create a temporary version of the card for use in duels. It doh even have to be physical, just a man logged in as the controller who is willing to input "#12345 (purple eyes pink dragon) merges with #54321 (jar of pepper sauce)" when a player makes a choice.

Probably, but where would the money come from? I'm seeing even more money getting pulled down the drain again.


Yes, it is quite possible to do. We have the technology. Chances are, though, the thought is laughable because there are FAR too many disadvantages to implementing this kind of thing to date. Not only would it cost the corporations an arm and a leg to do, but duelists will probably not want to gravitate to this at the cost of their cards or their freedom to pull up a chair and duel the old fashioned way.
Living in the past?
Nope. Being realistic right now.

Oh, and Gambitt....kiva may like your attitude, but I sure as hell don't.
Do NOT turn this into another debate thread like you did that Jack thompson petition. That is all.

[SPK]

Um...there is also one little thing that can allow current cards to be used.

There is a serial code on each card, that is unique for that type of card. You mainly see it in use for the GB games, where u have to input the code from the card, and u can then have access to that card in the game itself...

[Gambitt]

Exactly...'if they wanted to.' Go up to any Upperdeck executive, and ask them 'Are you guys going to do virtual arenas or holographic projections of the cards?' and they would tell you 'No.' And, chances are, they probably wouldn't even think about it. It would cost them millions of dollars in R&D to develop such technology (and do so in the midst of severe uncertainty if it will even catch on in the first place) and probably millions more to find venues to place these things, because compact technology or even arcade cabinet sized technology is going to take a LOT of time AND money.
All of this, without a SINGLE idea of whether it's even a smart idea to do so, because people might prefer to duel on tables and so on as they always have, and use the technology for show-off purposes only.

Sigh. Boss, how many games out there involve these card things? I can think of three off-hand that have made a fair bit of change off people head. Now lets say someone were to go to lets just say Nintendo and say "eh boss I have an idea fo how you can use preexisting technology to create a holographic version of your "pokemon stadium" or you could do a "UGO arena" or a "Magik the coming together" all pretty much using the same equipment that nobody else has put together yet.

That way they do the R&D for multiple games at the same time, and I figure if they come good all three games will be willing to hitch onto the wagon. Toss in a "battle chess" and a "Star wars battle chess" too because you know both will have cult followings (ever see dem chess men play on the promenade? dey wuss than allyuh trading card game peeongs).

On top of that, even if it did get off the ground, do you have any ideas how long and difficult tournaments would be to organise and schedule with them? It would run well into several delays in setting up the technology and providing failsafes. Don't get me started on if there's a power outtage.

Yeah, pick up cabinet. Move cabinet. Plug cabinet in. Plug in controller box for cabinet (if yuh going with the "we will facilitate allyuh loooosers who havent upgraded to the new cards" option). Swipe cards. Play. Every 6 months or so, someone updates the game memory to accomodate for the new cards that have been released.

No you cannot have all 100 men lined up to play on the single cabinet, but you could do the final round, and maybe a couple rounds with people who happen to be packing the cards.

Oh please. Smoke Boxes? How long do you think the duel would last if you had to resort to that? Not only would the smoke blow away in more ventilated places, but what about those who wouldn't be able to tolerate the smoke? Clubs do it just for (temporary) effect, what makes you think that'll even work for a duel that can last for a whole 30 minutes?

Friend, condensing water vapour counts as smoke in this case. You know that stuff you see when one opens a freezer. I dont think anyone will be dead at the end of a long round. I agree you would not be able to do this in a place where there's a lot of breeze, but then again playing all fours in a place where there is a lot of breeze can be a pain in the ass too. I dont think anyone has as yet complained to playing card manufacturers that their equipment is defective because a good breeze makes it inoperable.

I think it can work for the full 30 mins because I've seen plans for a "magic lantern" that used smoke. It's a type of old time projector. This one had a series of mirrors meant to project an image back onto the smoke coming from the box. Result is that an image would appear to be floating in the smoke when viewed from the correct angles.

Wrong. Wrong. DEAD wrong. Do you honestly think people would just chuck their cards away because Upperdeck says play with the new versions instead that easily? The whole reason we even HAVE a Traditional format (where banned cards are allowed) is because people complained to Upperdeck and threatened to even leave the game if they were forced to not use certains cards ever again.

So, I'm sorry. I'm not tossing away any cards that I shelled out hundreds of dollars for just so I can use one that fulfills the same function and can be used on a holographic arena that I probably will have limited access to compared to what I can use at home.

And if that were to happen, Upperdeck stands to severely LOSE on sales on their previous boosters, because they may not be holographically compatible. So, no, Gambitt. Yu-Gi-Oh! cards are not like your NES cartridges, at all. Because the whole reason why you can't use use those cartridges on the newer systems is because the TECHNOLOGY IS OBSOLETE. The cards, on the other hand, were made to last as long as the game itself does.

Who said you had to chuck away your cards? Didnt I mention that I still have the old NES cartridges, and that I can still play them if I want. If you doh want to get rid of your cards, well cool. But as you said, the cards will last for as long as the game does (or really vice versa I guess). But I figure it is the same as my NES cartridge thing, because the game developers could easily have made it backwards compatible. The game itself is software and is not obsolete, the hardware originally used to run it may be. (To me this is like u saying that MUDs are obsolete because MMORPG's exist. My old 200 mhz box cannot handle WOW while it could do MUDS. My new computer can do both if I choose to play either.)

 One way or the other if you want to have a holographic game you going to have to update the cards.  But as I said, and I see SPK confirming, you could input the serial numbers of your cards into the game and use them in the game, since support for all the cards are really already encoded into the actual electronic device. Yes you would need someone to stand over a man and make sure he doesnt cheat bu inputting a card he does not actually have, but I guess you guys do that already. Or the issue of fake cards on the market would never have arisen in the past, right?

And before you ask, yes I do agree that the data encoded on magnetic swipe cards would be fairly easy to duplicate with the right equipment

Nobody saying it would only take a man a day to put together and it could be on the shelves by nextweek tuesday.

You could have your "holographic" game in pretty short order, if someone figured it was worth doing, it's not really that far beyond what we already had, just a different way of putting it together.

...contradicting yourself.....

Only if you consider  the development of a game to be overnight and having it, distributed and on sale in a week, "short order". I dont, and doubt that most people do either. But if the game companies decide to create one, they could have a prototype knocked together in a few months I'd guess. Completely coding the game and rulesets, will take a while, but that's true of most games, isnt it?

Of course on the otherhand the corporation could allow "dual centres" to create a temporary version of the card for use in duels. It doh even have to be physical, just a man logged in as the controller who is willing to input "#12345 (purple eyes pink dragon) merges with #54321 (jar of pepper sauce)" when a player makes a choice.

Probably, but where would the money come from? I'm seeing even more money getting pulled down the drain again.

Uh, where? The temporary version of cards as I said wouldnt have to be physical. Just someone (the judges for the tournament) to input a number like #12345 for that particular card.

Yes, it is quite possible to do. We have the technology. Chances are, though, the thought is laughable because there are FAR too many disadvantages to implementing this kind of thing to date. Not only would it cost the corporations an arm and a leg to do, but duelists will probably not want to gravitate to this at the cost of their cards or their freedom to pull up a chair and duel the old fashioned way.
Living in the past?
Nope. Being realistic right now.

Not really, just closed minded. The existence of this would not equate to you having to give up  playing on a table without the technology. Like the old NES games I can still play them if I choose. You seem stuck on the idea of throwing your cards away, why?

Oh, and Gambitt....kiva may like your attitude, but I sure as hell don't.
Do NOT turn this into another debate thread like you did that Jack thompson petition. That is all.

I will reply to that part in a private message.

[JAvid The Brave Warrior]

LMFAO....you know i have to say you all are mad funny.....anyways........

well yeeah i'd be cool...expensive...and yeah i agree if it's made they'll most likely hold the finals in that.........cuz time will be of the matter (as mentioned before)
it'll also make this game so much popular...

but the question remains is: "is ude willing to make this"
and yes we do have the technology to make this.......but the atk movements and so on........DAMN it'd be awesome

[kiya]

Thats just what i was thinking!
Some people have no vision!

[EmpireKing]

I sure sum crazi japanese peeps workin on d yugioh holographic thingy

[New Era Outlaw]

You know what? That's probably true. We never know what those wacky Japs are up to until they spring the next big thing on us.

[einstien101]

they wouldnt have to make new cards, they could use scanners to read the serial numbers on the card, the amount of cheating that would go on though would be insane, cus then u just need to print out a piece of cardboard with the no. in the right place. but perhaps if they made like the old school ones kaibs used in the beginning of the show and use them for the world championships and sjcs or sumn, unfortunately at the end of the day the game is in the hands of konami and yugioh will never get the prizes and recognition it deserves until ude gets full control.

[kiya]

they wouldnt have to make new cards, they could use scanners to read the serial numbers on the card, the amount of cheating that would go on though would be insane, cus then u just need to print out a piece of cardboard with the no. in the right place. but perhaps if they made like the old school ones kaibs used in the beginning of the show and use them for the world championships and sjcs or sumn, unfortunately at the end of the day the game is in the hands of konami and yugioh will never get the prizes and recognition it deserves until ude gets full control.

True, the game needs to b taken to the next level!

[New Era Outlaw]

Oh freaking GOD, kiya.
No offense, but you revived this thread after a whole YEAR just to say that?


Consider this thread locked.