Arab on a leash...

[Kayode]

My question was meant as sarcasm

Is cool either way. Some things just need to be said.

I'm amused by how few people read and respond to threads like these.                    

[trinigamer]

At least Saddam and Castro do it to their own countrymen. The US soldiers actually go to other countries to do it.

Yes, we all know its less of a crime if you do it your own countrymen than people from other countries.

Don't forget in your own example, it was US soldiers that testified against their own, and helped some Vietnamese escape.

Atrocity and war are constant companions. It doesn't have to be war in other countries. Don't forget the Bosnian rapes, Rwandan genocide. Even the American Civil War had its share. To actually expect Americans to live up to their own ideals 100% of the time is pure fantasy. They are no better or worse than most other people out there, they just think they are and, for better or worse, they have the ability to influence policy that the rest of the world doesn't have. And like most in positions of influence, they're damned if they do, and damned if they don't.

By the way, if you had to choose between Dubya and Saddam as a prison warden, which one would you choose?

[/url]http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warpcent.htm[/url]                    

[Kayode]

By the way, if you had to choose between Dubya and Saddam as a prison warden, which one would you choose?

I never understand the point of that question.

It's always presented as if it's an eventual choice we would have had to make if the War didn't take place.

"Who would you rather have in charge...America or Iraq?"

But that is nonsense. Iraq didn't have the Power America has and they weren't trying to take over the world. Nobody had to choose except the Iraqis. And it's obbvious that even there the choice is split down the middle.

If Saddam's people were being oppressed, Revolution would have come sooner than later, as bloody and chaotic as it would have been. That's how countries change. That's how America was born.


But you were right about this:

They are no better or worse than most other people out there, they just think they are and, for better or worse, they have the ability to influence policy that the rest of the world doesn't have.

                   

[PyroSlasher]

Well honestly it is a sensitive subject but it should be talked about.... Pyro your depth as an individual or the lack of it scares me..... Is this war this generations vietnam

Who the hell are u?I never even spoke to u before and u want to judge me?Yet another fool who wants to judge me.Waste of time.

Oh and Kayode,your right.It is the bar and anything is relevant.

But as for others,dont f**king try to judge me without even f**king knowing me.MC jed.                    

[Rampage]

We have to hope Bush loses the election, this is shameful. If he's not ousted I done seeing ah next World War iwmc.

no way in hell he gonna win again. after all the protest and broken promises. but then again, some americans stupid and aint go know better and still vote for him. thats life oui.

ohh and bush never won really in the first place!                    

[Anonymous]

sad stuff                    

[Anonymous]

sad stuff

yeah rum u know
the war in iraq should not have happened the way it had

and at the begining of the war
i was quoted in the papers saying that
i cant remmeber what date
but they interviewed our school newpapers and asked us that question.

its a sad thing


and it is even a sadder thing so see what certain ppl in this thread had to say
pyroslasher
and sensei

and pyro ppl could only judge u by what u say and your actions
and so far they say u are a shallow jackass!                    

[Kayode]

That video of the man being beheaded is one of the most horrific things I've ever seen.                    

[Rommel]

pyroslasher and sensei voice their opinions just like Kayode did

and just as Kayode is right to be allowed to post his take on the war on Iraq

pyroslaher has the right to bring up reservations about a topic such as this

as for sensei he is just making a joke
but his post before shows that he does think that this is serious

but I notice that you (itachi) didn't say Baego's name

if sensei is guilty of anything then so is Baego


my opinion is that an undertaking such as "Iraqi freedom" is bound to have such tradegies due to the bad side of humans, all humans, even we trinis
as such while it is possible to have liberated Iraq properly without criminal activity
in this case I believe that the americans failed
while I do think that american troops were needed to stay in Iraq to prevent such things like an invasion from Iran (look at how North veitnam won that war) or a break down of society, how that is done is another story and I believe that while there is a proper way to do it, again the americans did not do it right

however, we do not know who is directly reponsible. We cannot automatically assume Bush as instructions for the events/crimes could have originated from him or people below him
however as the american president, he is indierctly responsible for everything done by those under his authority
what he does in response to this MAY show something of what kind of man he is

however for those who can understand what this, know that he is in "the lodge"

but his stance on other issuse if genuine, still leads me to wonder what kind of man he truly is

however in my opinion, Kayode I do not think that you are completely right
I still feel that the inner workings of what goes on is unknown to us
and as such any opinions are only speculations as they are built with an incomplete picture

as for anyone who said that going to war was wrong, they were right about the outcome, but wrong for their resoning, in some cases, but not all

the question souldn't hyave been if war sould be waged to remove saddam
but whether or not it would be done responsibly enough so as to ensure that the liberators would not cause more trouble than is "acceptable" for lack of a better word

just as there are no WMD found
not many proponents of not going to war expected for there to be such criminal activity of that nature

Kayode however had a good idea of what migh of happened
I doubt that you quite expected this though


but this is the straw that breaks my camel's back, for only one or two thing though
I wasn't as pro american as you may think

but my position is this

our own country is in need
let us leave the rest of the world alone and do what we can here
especially since we can do little if anything for them
but by helping TnT, perhaps we can help everyone else......at least eventually                    

[Rampage]

here is a link to the uncensored video:
http://www.foundrynap.com/iraq2vediow.zip

it small, 5mb. p.s its extremely graphic, you been warned!


them real evil boy! the fella gone for work, he aint no army man or come to kill anyone. lawd i feel sorry for the fella family an thing to see that oui. that is real pressure dey. that ofcourse just gave bush another excuse for the war. "to remove the barbarians".                    

[SUPR3M3]

Wow!!
After seeing that I seriously have a pain in my stomach and a heartfelt pain for that man family. It's very sad =(                    

[Rommel]

what would you do for the ideal?                    

[Kayode]

Let Iraqis fight for their own freedom and forge a nation for themselves, just as America and most other great nations have.

This assisted childbirth of a new Iraqi nation comes at too high a cost, and because of it, Iraqis won't have a truly sovereign identity...not for a long, long time.

The lack of WMDs and the absence of any real terrorist ties in Iraq means that "liberation" was the only real reason for the War.

But there are countries that have it so much worse off than Iraq now.

And how can any one nation judge who is to be "liberated" man? What next...they will storm Cuba?


As for the whole idea of the common man "not knowing"...true, we don't know everything going on here, but what we do know stacks up overwhelmingly against the War. And it also indicates that we're either being lied to or that the people we're supposed to trust are clueless.

Democracy isn't about keeping secrets and acting on them without public approval. It isn't about lying to the public either. There needs to be trasnparency in this issue, or as history has shown us, we can easily assume that whatever's being hidden by the governments (on both sides) is either illegal or immoral.

This isn't the MIB or Tom Clancy. The public NEEDS to know where their money is going and where their countrymen are being sent, what their elected administration's real plans are. Secrecy can only mean malevolence in this case.

History will not be kind to this War. This whole even is just wrong from the ground up. No one even seems to be trying to justify it anymore.

This is NOT a fight of good against evil. If it is, good sure as hell isn't winning.                    

[carlsberg]

now they trying 2 cover it up

they are claiming that the photos that were released were a forgerie

created by some British newsreporter                    

[Kayode]

They're probably right. It's no big deal if they are. The British photos were few compared to the hundreds of photos released by the US government itself.                    

[Bsensei]

anyone say the video? I hear it's highly disturbing