Trinilink's PC upgrade build(s)

[TriniLink]

Hiya GATTers, this is my first pc build on the forums. I'm seeking to build a new system to run online games like FireFall, WildStar, Guild wars 2 and Continent of the Ninth. Also Steam games.

My current wishlist is as follows, as well as what i already bought is listed here: http://www.carigamers.com/cms/forums/index.php/topic,18565.msg310587/topicseen.html#new

Ref site: www.Amazon.com, http://www.pcczone.com/pc-builder/ (This site helped with compatibility of parts)

Gaming PC performance selection.
Processor: AMD Vishera FX-4350 4.2GHz AM3+ Processor FD4350FRHKBOX

Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-970A-D3P AM3+ DDR3 Motherboard ATX 
or Asus SABERTOOTH 990FX R2.0 AM3+ DDR3 Motherboard ATX

RAM: Corsair ValueSelect 16GB DDR3 1333MHz Desktop Memory CMV16GX3M2A1333C9

HD: WD Black 1TB SATA 6.0 3.5" Desktop HDD WD1003FZEX 

GPU: Asus HD7750 1GD5 DDR5 Video Card HD7750-1GD5-V2 

Audio Card: Either integrated or Asus XONAR_DG 3D Audio Gaming Sound Card 

Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST 24x SATA Optical Drive DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B

CPU Cooling: Corsair Hydro Series H60 Intel/AMD High Performance Liquid CPU Cooler CW-9060007-WW 

PSU: Thermaltake Smart Series 750W Power Supply SP-750M 

Computer Case:  Cooler Master HAF 912 RC-912-KKN1 Mid Tower

OS: Win 7 Ultimate 64 bit or Win 8.1 Pro 64 bit

Monitor: Decision Pending.

Site quotation cost: $1086.49 US Total.

Mini PC tower build consideration (currently building):

APU: AMD A10-7850K Kaveri 3.7GHz Socket FM2+ 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor AMD Radeon R7
series AD785KXBJABOX (185 US) 

Mobo: ASRock FM2A78M-ITX+ FM2+ / FM2 AMD A78 (Bolton D3) HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Mini ITX AMD Motherboard (90 US)

RAM: G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 2133 (PC3 17000) Desktop
Memory Model F3-17000CL11D-8GBXL

Case:Cooler Master Elite 120 Advanced - Mini-ITX Computer Case with USB 3.0 and Long Graphics Card Support  (40US) BOUGHT

HD: Still deciding, will be inclusive of a SSD
 
Audio Card: Either integrated or Asus XONAR_DG 3D Audio Gaming Sound Card 

Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST 24x SATA Optical Drive DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B

CPU Cooling: Corsair Hydro Series H60 Intel/AMD High Performance Liquid CPU Cooler CW-9060007-WW 

PSU: Rosewill Stallion Series RD500-2DB 500W ATX12V Power Supply

OS: Win 8.1 Pro 64 bit
Monitor: Decision Pending.

[Arcmanov]

1st question...

Why an AMD build, and not a similarly priced, better performing Intel Core i5/i7-based build?





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[TriniLink]

Budget of 4k to get up and running, with 6-8k full build.

For the small build looking forward to the upcoming features for the Kaveri processor, as well as no need to buy a separate GPU as it's an on board R7 built into the processor, as well as the upcoming AMD mantle support later on this year. Was inspired by Linus Tech tips youtube videos of such custom builds as his was an Intel build I decided on the AMD close mirror of his set-up.

Wanted a good system to last another 7 years as my current pc now lives that long. I'm aware the Kaveri isn't steam OS compatible, so as is it's an upgrade to my current system. Mid range gaming tower mini ITX, with the big build to be my monster all round pc (maybe in 2 years or less).

Ref video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9_8FaeY4r8
Step by step guide hands on: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlCqYyAQE_w

Plus the power to run Battlefield 4 without a separate GPU with the right ram and MoBo.

See for yourself here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymoJOBJEMsg and here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=axyHkKn_e80.

We'll see how this DirectX Vs. Mantle software plays out in the coming months.

[W1nTry]

As much as I'm a long time supporter of AMD arc mashes sense,  go cheap Intel now Even if it's not technically a perfect alternative to the 4350. Better future proofing as even the  APU will require a new socket soon but will remain under powered compared to Intel.

AMD for htpc IMHO, go cheap Intel dual,  socket 1150 mobo and a decent Gpu.

Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk

[TriniLink]

The grand build is pensive atm, currently building the Mini ITX system. Grand build is up for debate.

As of this posting, most stores don't have the parts for this build, so online buying and waiting is the plan for now. Is there a CPU heatsink besides stock that can fit in my case? and if not, what's the best affordable  water cooled solution?
 

[Arcmanov]

You should be looking at the much better Cooler Master Elite 130 instead.

The 120 has no all-in-one LC kit support. (without modding)

The only other air cooler that fits is the low-profile Noctua NH-L9i, and another similar one from Silverstone.





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[VirtueTT]

Wait.. You're buying your parts locally?

[TriniLink]

Was thinking of, but until I get a price list from PRW for sure (or if they ever get their site back up) I order the parts from Amazon.com. Anyone ever bought from Tiger direct and do they accept VTM cards?

[VirtueTT]

A few things can be changed on that list, in my opinion, to get the best performance for your money. And as much as I am an AMD fanboy, Intel is the better choice. CPU wise at least. When it comes to GPU, there is a bit of competition.

My questions with regards to the Gaming PC:

BIG QUESTION: What games do you play/want to be able to play?

Other technical questions:

1) Do you intend to Overclock?

2) Do you intend to put another GPU?


Looking at the choice of CPU, you can't really do much with it since it's already stock at 4.2 Ghz. Even at that speed, the lowest Intel i5 outperforms it by a landslide. Price difference of about $50-60 USD I say is worth conquering the performance gap.

The water cooling solution may also be a waste as there are good (cheaper) air cooling solutions available that compare and beat the H60. If you already live in a moderately cool house you'll be fine on air cooling. If you have AC, even better. Arcman can point you to a good one. I'd tell you go with a CM Hyper Evo 212 which you seem to already have.

The ASUS Sabertooth MB is a waste on that CPU. You can't overclock it that much if at all. The extra features/slots will also not really be used if you don't have a multi-GPU set up.

16 GB of RAM is nice.... But ONLY if you need it. Most games can't even cause 8 GB of RAM to be under stress. I have been told that 16 GB of RAM does however extend the life of an SSD but that's beside the point.

If that's the GPU you're going with, which is old tech and a mid range card, considering the other components, the 750W PSU is unnecessary. A 600-650w is more than good enough. Some others will tell you it's better to be safe than sorry though =p


That's my take on what you have up there so far.

As for the HTPC. It looks good but as Arcman and W1nTry pointed out, that case can't hold the water cooler without modding.

But to be quite fair... if you don't plan on playing overly demanding games or aren't someone who cares for maxing settings and 60+ FPS, then the AMD system with a mid range card will work. Just had to include this because most of us will jump on the "Beast system" pov first.

[TriniLink]

My questions with regards to the Gaming PC:

BIG QUESTION: What games do you play/want to be able to play?

Other technical questions:

1) Do you intend to Overclock?

2) Do you intend to put another GPU?

1) I'm seeking to build a new system to run online games like FireFall, WildStar, Guild wars 2 and Continent of the Ninth. Also Steam games.

2) Will go into overclocking to speed up web streaming, Home theatre system, Steam Big Picture, as well as possible start my own Youtube let's Play.

3) Currently i own a Nividia Geforce GTX550 TI to use with the HTPC, but thinking of getting a NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti 2GB to work in Hybrid SLI if the Mini ITX board supports it.

Main reason of the upgrade is that my current system limit is the RAM which is DDR2 and isn't worth investing in new ram for it currently. The current system will be my Crafting/work horse for my side business as well as running my low res 2D online games and emulators till it dies on me. When it does I'll transfer to the new systems. 

Yea the parts are all mid range for the proposed beast, I chose those from http://www.pcczone.com/pc-builder/ (This site helped with compatibility of parts) to fit my current funds for a mid range system. ( Yea, figures most of you all would have taken note of the big system specs at the get go and fleetingly watch the Mini ITX system like a smoking disclaimer)  Also for the fact that no one I know of who has a HTPC like this and wanted to build my own.

All jokes aside, I appreciate the input so far from what you all suggest. Given the type of games listed above, What mid/high range PC build would you all suggest? I'll post the specs of each one and you all let me know what I can get for a 3k-8k TT Budget that will still be good for games for the next 3-7 Years (Lord Willing) catered for the MMO/PC RPG gamer. Was also thinking of supporting TitanFall; knowing i'll be schooled before I get any good in it; Plannetside 2 and FireFall(Which would be my re-entry into a shooter/RPG genre on the whole).

[TriniLink]

Great site for the Big question: Can my system run (Insert game name here)?

http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri

Firefall: http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri/requirements/firefall-beta/11390/?p=r

Wildstar: http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri/requirements/wildstar-beta/11647/?p=r

D&D Neverwinter: http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri/requirements/dungeons-and-dragons-neverwinter/11660/?p=r

Planetside 2: http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri/requirements/planetside-2/11448/?p=a

Oh and Dark Souls 2, if I can manage it 

[VirtueTT]

I'll put something together for you tomorrow and post it.

Sent from my ASUS Transformer Pad TF700T using Tapatalk

[Arcmanov]

For the mini-ITX build, you can pretty much mimic the setup of my former 'HTPC' config,
which will run everything you can throw at it.

http://www.carigamers.com/cms/forums/index.php/topic,11652.msg298567.html#msg298567

If you're not using the HTPC for gaming, then you don't need such a beefy GPU.
That build had an Elite 120, which was replaced by an Elite 130 with a Seidon 120M kit.

Cooler Master Elite 130 - you can use the stock cooler, or an all-in-one kit like the Seidon 120M.
Gigabyte H61N-USB3 - Socket 1155 mini-ITX board that can use Sandy Bridge (like the Core i5/i7 2xxx) and Ivy bridge (like the Core i5/i7 3xxx) CPUs.

All other hardware can be your preference, based on your budget.

3) Currently i own a Nividia Geforce GTX550 TI to use with the HTPC, but thinking of getting a NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti 2GB to work in Hybrid SLI if the Mini ITX board supports it.

There is no such thing as 'Hybrid SLI' for desktop motherboards at least. 
The 750 Ti would work nicely though.

[TriniLink]

There is no such thing as 'Hybrid SLI' for desktop motherboards at least. 

Although outdated, prepare to stand corrected. My Current Pc Mobo has Hybrid SLI in the BIOS and works good, albeit the compatible GPU's that work for it are way outdated.

XFX Geforce 8200 Mobo
http://www.motherboards.org/reviews/motherboards/1799_2.html

I plan to also work with this feature for the APU 10 Mini ITX gaming system, for as long as it's supported.

I plan to have a setup like this:

[Arcmanov]

Interesting.

I stand duly corrected then.   
I thought this feature existed only in laptops.

I think AMD's solution is a bit more current, but may only be implemented in ATX and m-ATX motherboards as of now.

You might be better off just sticking with an Intel solution, and a GTX 750Ti/760.
There are no 'gotchas' I can think of that will be showstoppers.




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[VirtueTT]

CPU
Intel Core i5-4570 3.2GHz LGA 1150 84W Quad-Core Desktop Processor - $200.00 USD


Motherboard
ASUS H87M-PLUS/CSM DDR3 1600 LGA 1150 Motherboard - $105.00 USD

RAM
G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 - $91.00 USD

CPU Cooler
Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO - CPU Cooler with 120mm PWM Fan - $34.00 USD

PSU
Corsair CX Series 600 Watt ATX/EPS Modular 80 PLUS Bronze - $76.00 USD

Hard Drive
Western Digital 1 TB SATA III 7200 RPM 64 MB - $86.00 USD

GPU
GTX 760.. Depends on your preference of manufacturer/style. $260.00 USD

OR

GTX 750 ti.. $150 - $180 USD

OS
Windows 8.1 - Fre.... $106.00 USD

You can get an optical drive down here for $120 TTD at Super Tech. My advice when it comes to a case is to try and find one here that you like to save some money on the shipping. Even a 2nd hand case in good condition is good too.

The listed price of the above comes up to a total of $700 USD not counting the GPU, Case, Optical Drive, and Monitor. That translates to about $4600 TTD not including shipping and possible tax.

If you go with an AMD based system, it's going to bump the price down by $100 USD if so much. If you really want to not have issues with performance for the next 4 years, Intel is the way to go. Not to mention the fact that AMD is phasing out discrete CPU's and upgrades for an AMD system will no longer be possible in that regard.

When it comes to the GPU, my opinion is that you spend the cash on a decent GPU ie the GTX 760. You will have NO issues with any games. That card is capable of running games like BF4, Bioshock and much more on ultra at over 60 FPS. It will definitely last you a solid 4 years.

[TriniLink]

You got the gears in my mind turning, nice. I'm curious about the hybrid sli/ crossfire feature, and if there is such a feature supported by an Intel processor/Mobo/GPU. Is there any that is affordable for within the 4-6k TT bracket? sans monitor and peripherals.

This quote from Virtue has dug me out of the rut that I had with the APU A-10 mindset. hmmm... Though I'll be following where they plan to go with the proposed AMD mantle support later on this year.


I'm researching the pros/cons of Mantle Vs. DirectX debate and features. Also checking those specs of those parts Virtue. Still working on the Small build to support the HTPC with gaming to support Firefall, Planetside2 , Wildstar and more MMO's as they come out. Any other person plays these games?I saw Arc's pictures, but would be nice to see your high def video guys, feeling alone with this genre here... *crickets chirping*


Quoting Arc about Planetside 2:

Not sure what game engine is in use here, but it certainly gave my rig a swift kick in the teeth...after it sank to it's knees from the
first kick in the nuts.     Yeah...you're gonna want to play this one on 'medium'.


What struck me first was the SIZE.    The map I was dropped into easily puts every other shooter. To. Shame.
Bases are gargantuan in size...and the DISTANCES between bases...good lord.  Coordination and communication are actually
more important than shooting people.  Lone-wolfing, will get you nothing but a full clip to the chest.


I will admit...it's a bit overwhelming.  Just the tutorial page will take about a few days to properly get through.

I know Titanfall is the big rush as of this posting, but whenever the GATT guild wants to get into a session I'm in. I look forward to it.

[Arcmanov]

Nice.

I still have Planetside 2 installed, but I haven't run it in a while, so I'm sure it needs a LOT of updating.
I also dabble in Firefall every now and then as well.

Then there's that other mech game everyone has conveniently forgotten called Hawken. 


Right now, Nvidia drivers and software features make up for whatever performance gap Mantle gives the AMD cards.
I'll recommend a GTX 770 over a R9 280X any day.
Shadow Play alone makes it a wash for me.





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[VirtueTT]

I have honestly done the research a while back on the hybrid CrossFire option. All results showed that it wasn't worth it. We have a PC at home with an AMD A10-5800k so i was looking at the option for a little extra gaming power. The link below shows some benchmarks for the older APU's. Have a look through it and see their review. The last page is titled, "AMD Dual Graphics: Good for Benchmarks, Not for Gaming."

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/dual-graphics-crossfire-benchmark,3583.html

As for your MMO's. I don't know anyone who plays those games. Not my kettle of fish either.

I would have posted the links for you for those parts but it was looking too messy in the thread and I for the life of me can't remember how to embed the URL into text like what Arcman does all the time.. 

I do have an R9-280x and it performs beautifully. With Mantle and an AMD CPU, I see a constant 65-80 FPS in BF4 on max settings at 1080p. Mantle drivers are still in the works so we'll see how much more performance they can squeeze out of it. The downside to Mantle is that it's only available for 2 games... BF4 and Thief right now. There are some 3 other titles that seem to be using it but aren't out yet. The potential is there but Direct X is still dominant right now.

Also, Microsoft intends to launch Direct X 12 this year which also has the possibility of sinking Mantle back into the depths of the earth. See what i did there? 

[TriniLink]

One of you guys; if possible; should pass by me some weekend and guide me with this Mini ITX build, also after debate for the case;Cooler Master Elite 120 Advanced; I bought and upgrade to a Corsair Obsidian 250D. This possibly will be my first Intel PC build.

Also, what are your thoughts on ordering a pre built system and how upgradeable is it?

For example: http://www.amazon.com/CyberpowerPC-Gamer-Ultra-GUA880-Desktop/dp/B0089KDCIU/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1394805559&sr=1-2&keywords=cooler+master+250D