Is PC Gaming Dead? (as we knew it)

[MessiaaH]

Yup, Company of heroes online, completely free, and seems to be d new time sucker on mumble.

Edit:

One important thing i forget to mention about pc gaming.
Online gaming is completely FREE! So subscriptions to worry bout, no fees, no nothing.
Steam->Search->Buy->PLAY!

[ViCe]

but messiah das what i have a ps3 for.......if i wanna watch 1080p blu ray content is on meh ps3 it playin and my netbook editing videos just fine with sony vegas

and last but not least PC DONT have the games i want
almost everything i want that PC hav comes out on consoles PLUS i get console exclusive games which i might add are the ones i end up playin the most.......soooo was d point in gettin a high end PC again?

i not sayin PC gamin dead btw
it more on a decline or just stagnant imo as there really isnt anything that would really take away a man from a console to go PC when he basically gettin d same games and more plus without headaches of upgrading and tweakin etc


PS: PSN free to eh.....just sayin

[MessiaaH]

if u dont care for d pc exclusives, den no, there is no point to u! lol.
Man like me, give up sc2? YUH CRAZY! give up my superior graphics? HELLSSS no.
AND when i say bluray content i not talking bout yet another scratchable disk to worry bout.
Unless ps3 offering bluray content over d air now.

When i ready to take in some stargate bluray, i juss click play, dont have to worry bout nothing, it there waiting.

And if u satisfied with a low end netbook, then great, i surely was not. Hence my upgrade.

And i understand yuh argument, because d same way u dont think it have anything to take a man away from a console. D same way i dont think xbox/ps3 have anything to take me away from d PC.

Did i mention pc gaming online is free?
here's an epic Completely Free to Download Game / Free to play online.
Built on an enhanced version of DOW2 engine. D very popular COH!
http://www.carigamers.com/cms/forums/index.php/topic,20578.msg257138.html#msg257138

Edit:

And what u call "headaches of upgrading / tweaks" i call FUN!
And again, please refer to d numerous articles and facts posted throughout d thread to support pc gaming not declining, nor stagnant, but growing, and improving. albeit not at d insane rate of consoles.
But thanks to steam and d others, PC is gettin there.

[ViCe]

company of heroes an rts?
personally not a big fan of RTS games and tbh the only one i really played and spent time on was sc1 hence in due time whenever i will take a tush on sc2
only other rts that had me interested was RUSE and that i want on ps3 to play with the PS Move when i get it lol

[MessiaaH]

Another point id like to make, a cheap netbook is what? 300US$
Add another 300$ and u get d whole package, still comparable in price to ps3+netbook.
But with 4 times d power of a cheap netbook.

And yes, COH is RTS, its good, relic makes good shit.
SC2 juss come out and pwn everybody lol. But its still good. Hell its free!
And move is expensiveeeeee!!!, i was reading an article, some games even require 2 wands, plus cam, time u add some more players, d cost of move was very high, compared to kinect and wii. It was actualy a faceoff between d 3, d wii won, for price, game library, and something else. Followed by xbox, ps3 came last even though it is d most acurate of d 3. And d price of dat move business, d cost of games, dat bundle will keep going up, and up, and up, and 600$ for a pc tuh do eveyrhting, suddenly seems very attractive.

[IsMe2003]

but messiah das what i have a ps3 for.......if i wanna watch 1080p blu ray content is on meh ps3 it playin and my netbook editing videos just fine with sony vegas

and last but not least PC DONT have the games i want
almost everything i want that PC hav comes out on consoles PLUS i get console exclusive games which i might add are the ones i end up playin the most.......soooo was d point in gettin a high end PC again?

i not sayin PC gamin dead btw
it more on a decline or just stagnant imo as there really isnt anything that would really take away a man from a console to go PC when he basically gettin d same games and more plus without headaches of upgrading and tweakin etc


PS: PSN free to eh.....just sayin

I think it boils down to a preference in a sense, i got the consoles, but i the opposite, there isn't anything that can take me away from the PC to go dust of the PS3 or 360, switch it on and insert a CD, not to say i bashing consoles, i just lazy i guess, the best thing to slice bread for me on the consoles front is tat new PSP Go, now thats the shit, assign credits on meh account click buy, download the game, click play & talk done (Just like Steam). I hope all consoles will follow along them lines and get some better graphics whiles they at it then i might be interested ah think, but then they might start calling them PCs or compusoles? ?

imo pc game is far from stagnant/declining now a days, 3 or 4 years ago i would have said so as i was scrunting for titles to play especial action/co-op type games (I gave in at one point and went ps2 for jack and daxter and Maximo), but now looks way brighter as it now have so much more games to play thanks to steam making it so easy to find/get games i never knew existed like that Lara Craft, only thing left for steam to do now is make new digital releases like the Transformers War for Cybertron cheaper than the hard copy version even by a few dollers, that might finish kill of the hard copy sales but i think its needed, i see they complaining that Steam getting to big and want to break them up but so be it yes, they really working out positively for PC gaming.

That digital scene and the fact that they look like they got a hang on the piracy thing will drive the pc platform very nice i believe, just like everything, i got a blu-ray player and bought 2or 4 blu-ray discs, i dont think one ever made it out the plastic warping , i dont even know where them disc is to tell yua the truth :S, its all about digital 1080p content now and i pirate them like crazy, but if, or more like when they stop with this hard copy media business and start selling them digital download i will buy them movies without skipping a beat, so much nicer to have a movie collection stored in one spot that you can watch one after the next without leaving the couch to find ah disc and put it int he player, >>>> the name of the game is LAZY<<<<

[MessiaaH]

O, and for d ppl that think u need d latest and greatest pc rig to game.
My xps laptop is some 6-7 years old now, and still runs gears of war, starcraft 2, wii emulator, cod, etc etc etc.

Edit:

Pc gaming is dying ->

[IsMe2003]

PC when he basically gettin d same games and more plus without headaches of upgrading and tweakin etc

Just a note on the tweaking/upgrading bit, i think thats more of a hobby for the hardware men that into it, don't believe its really need (Unless is cryshit, opps i mean Crysis you talking about ), my 7 year old Dell xps 1710 laptop which i currently use for gaming in the living room until the Mini PC finish runs the same games i play on the big PC, granted at less eye-canadynisum but the game just auto detects the best settings and i roll with that, and because "dare i say it again" .... Steam, any game i got on the Big PC is automatically on my laptop along with all my saved games and all that shit (Think that game saves bit is more a games for windows live thing but yua get the point), same gonna happen with the Mini PC, sign into steam, go buss a shit, comeback and start playing game.

that is evidence in it self if you look at it that stuff improving on the PC besides having more games available today, a few years ago heaven forbid changing out yua gaming PC with drastic HW architecture changes, yua need 2 or 4 days just to install all the games over again assumign yua still have the CD, put all yua settings back, restore yau saved games assuming yau remember to back them up, all that drama before yua even start punging

[MessiaaH]

digital download is epic win for d future no matter how u slice it.
Cause i was buying my music cds, and rippin dem in lossless format, up untill men start torrenting it. Right now digital music is mp3, but if dey start sellin digital lossless format, i buying that! Same with digital bluray.

D games front juss ahead of d other 2, but only a matter of time.
When time for entertainment, weather it be, game, watch, or listen. Juss press->buy->play.

[ViCe]

@ messiah PS Move not really expensive.....at least not for me
i not gonna be playin shit yuh see.....so any Wii type trash will never be seen in my system i playin hardcore games like kz3 and socom 4 with d move so i only need wand + navi controller since i have a cam already BUT i might end up takin d bundle anyway since i heard the cam with the bundle is an updated one

i not gonna have 4 wands and ah setta crap runnin is big men playin not kids and i doh like lookin like a clown when i gamin hence the reason i will never....ever....ever buy a kinect

if anything i MIGHT get a 2nd wand in due time so with d bundle chicks can play dey lil sports champions

key difference btw with the Move and Kinect and Wii.......it has actual games

lastly yuh not really gonna win a cost argument battin for the PC eh just informing yuh
wyatt already laid it out nicely and i already showing u that u can get a PS3/360 and a decent comps for less than a gaming pc

PS: the only game on PC that can really see me hop on and spend any kinda time on is counter strike and sc2 (but not hardcore on d sc i not korean lol)......u wont find me on cod, and did the unreal tourney, SoF, Quake thing back in the day so yea only 2 games PC

if ever they make an updated CS and slap it on a console eh.......sigh......socom go hadda do for now lol

[TriniXaeno]

Fellas, there maybe hope after all!

[MessiaaH]

BOOORR!!!!!!!!!!

THATS WHAT WE TALKING ABOUT!

[ViCe]

lol @ wyatt link
he only went they cuz it hav more buttons doh mean nuttin!

if anything he go start off on d PC an migrate to consoles at a ripe age.......most do anyway 

[Spazosaurus]

I look forward to showing you dirty peasants how we roll with the kb&m.

[MessiaaH]

For analasys:

Wii Bundle : $177
http://www.amazon.com/Wii-Hardware-Bundle-Black-Nintendo/dp/B0045F8QDE/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1292370111&sr=8-4

Mario Galaxy: $40
http://www.amazon.com/Super-Mario-Galaxy-2-Nintendo-Wii/dp/B002BSA388/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1292370149&sr=8-1

New Super Mario Bros: $39.96
http://www.amazon.com/New-Super-Mario-Bros-Wii-Nintendo/dp/B002BRZ9G0/ref=sr_1_13?ie=UTF8&qid=1292370111&sr=8-13

Donkey Kong Country Returns: $39.54
http://www.amazon.com/Donkey-Kong-Country-Returns-Nintendo-Wii/dp/B003ZHMMEM/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1292370111&sr=8-14

Zelda Twilight Princess: $52
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000FQBPCQ/ref=ord_cart_shr?ie=UTF8&m=A183731WS5BVTK

[Mez]

My 2c on the 'Coma" that PC Gaming is in:

PC gaming has stagnated for a while due to a few things
1. Piracy, this is 2fold.
     Game developers have long battled PC Piracy and have LOST. Therefore they have resigned themselves to developing games strictly for console, which thru PSN and XboxLive are better able to control, detect and stop pirates. This is its own bane to PC gaming existence because developers dont feel the need to put as much effort into PC games (Case in point Black Ops)

2nd part: When I look at when most of us became 'gamers' its during the Childhood years. for arguments sake lets stick with the ages 9-18. As Wyatt rightly brought up, back when I was 9-18 Desktops were the mainstay, and the games developed were generally able to run on those machines. The piracy comes into play because, I dunno bout you, but I was only getting games for xmas or meh birthday and games were in high demand whereas money was in short supply. SO we pirated, not thru malice but 'necessity' (cue montage)
10 years later, we're big men/women and have the disposable income to purchase said games, which admittedly some of us still don't do.

This is because 10 years later, gaming has progressed to such a level that your 'moms desktop aint running shit but farmville. TO get the performance required to play a game satisfactorily, you NEED the expensive machine. Don't get me wrong, I cannot argue with Console's 'Cost Benefit Analysis' For $1300 US I got my LAPTOP ALONE. Which is why many 'Hardcore" Gamers, will still pirate cause after you spend a fat wad on the machine you aint gonna drop a dime on no damn game. For $1300 US I could get a PS3, Xbox Kinect and a years worth of gaming. Console WIn.
Not to mention, the proliferation of console gaming rental companies like Gamefly. The 'CD-Key' Piracy Prevention does not allow for a copy of a game to be rented out like how consoles do. This presents an interesting argument for 'death to CD-keys'?


MMORPGS
Gaming's progression has been pretty simple
Single Player was cool, until sitting behind someone watching them play was too much, so they invented Lan Play
Multiplayer LAN was cool, but the logistics in setting up something remotely more fun than you and ur neighbour playing 1v1 SOF soon became boring

SO we went online. and the death of LAN began. Online meant PC's had to be faster, and stronger on both ends, ISP and CPU/GPU. Driving up the cost again.

Another nail in the coffin for PC Gaming's Stagnation MMORPGS
From Ever Crack to 'WoW'
We see hordes of people paying a monthly subscription, to play a game which never ends(replay value) with friends from ALLOVER THE WORLD(gaming socially) Blizzard has hit the nail on the head where gaming is concerned, WoW can be played on pretty much ANYTHING (A neccessity IMHO) and it is highly addictive. The problem is, that MMORPGS are SO popular, that almost nothing else is being developed, and if it is, 'replayability' is an issue. Ten years ago, no one playing SOF gave 2 shits about levelling up. In COD BOPS, thats all people do... Gaming is no longer fun in some instances but becoming overly competitive with ranks, ladders, etc.

Personally I see two kinds of Gamers
Casual Gamers: People like myself, Who game frequently own maybe one or 2 titles and enjoy the 'versatility' that a high powered laptop brings. I cant Exactly photoshop on a PS3.

Hardcore Gamers: get almost every title out, gaming is their crack. and also pirate heavily because of sheer number of games.

Gamers like that, have their own reasons for PC Gaming, but you'll often find Hardcore Gamers, own a console as well. There are a few genres that IMHO will keep PC Gaming in at least a vegetative state: MMORPGS, FPS and RTS. those are the mainstays.
The console holds solid Sports, Fighting and RPG's.

There has been a lot more focus on developing better games for the Consoles simply because they are much easier to protect and therefore dev's get much better bang for their development buck. I dont think PC Gaming will ever die, but right now it's in a vegetative state. There are no real innovations being made in the PC gaming sector since more and more focus is being brought to Consoles. Christ, 'kinect like' software has been around for a decade in crappy webcam games but no one pushed forward. Why? because In the end, It wouldn't be worth it.

[TriniXaeno]

Very well said Mez. A meaty contribution and one I definitely agree with.

Thanks messiaah as well for the specs and wii pricing, that is absolutely perfect.

Spent most of the evening distilling all the points made from this thread.

It was an enormous amount of data. Much more than I expected to be honest.

Going to organize all of it into something cohesive so we can analyse the situation as scientifically as possible.

See the raw data below:


Industry Interest (lack thereof)
Piracy
Social Gaming
Development cost
Studios Closing
Digital Distribution
Public Servers
Lan Support
Sales Figures
Usage Figures
Active Local Community
PC games now being ports from console versions
DRM
Power of Console machines vs PC
Complexity of PC vs Console
Operating System cost and maintenance
Hardware Drivers
Computer Component Compatibility
Next Gen consoles likely to close performance/graphics gap
MMOs superior on PC
Kinect, Wii Motes and Move
Price per platform
PC Exclusives (SC2, Heart of Swarm, WoW, Diablo 3, etc..)
Bioware Superior PC versions (dragon age, me2)
DLC
Digital Distribution (Games for windows, Steam, etc..)
Witcher 2 (exclusive or no?)
Valve Interest in PC Left4dead2 tf2 HL3(multiplatform??)
DICE BC2 (VIETNAM)
Playing with friends cooperatively (360 best at it?)
success of console sku sales holding back development of superior PC games (crytek)
Developers say PC not making financial return hence publishers not bothering
Superior minority can fall before the inferior massess (Last of the mohicans, 300)
Entitlement complex (pay big $$ for PC, want games for free, motive to pirate)
Digital Download  and Online did not save Street Fighter 4 in Capcom's eyes.
ATI and Nvidia, only companies left doing graphics cards
Ventrilo / mumble on PC, Superior VOIP
No Discs for PC Gaming (Nothing to lose/scratch/etc...)
Worryless Updating (via steam)
XBL voice chat seamless, less to setup than  mumble
Ease of forming a party with friends on Live vs on PC
Searching for servers on PC difficult
Dedicated servers becoming problematic, buggy
Lag problems due to game servers being foreign based and not in Trinidad
Torrent makes piracy too easy, not just for the pc elite.
Effect of banning on xbox live for Piracy. PC has no equivalent
Xbox 360 as a PC (masquerading as a console)
Free online on PC, Wii and PS3
PC Customization (mods, settings, etc..)
Calculated sabotage of PC platform by big industry players (disabling features, neutering products,

etc.., alienating keyboard and mouse on consoles)
Ps3 legacy in Trinidad, community huge
Future Port of MMOs = GG
valve (PC Saviour) already releasing games on consoles
Excellent Deals on games via steam (discounts / promotions)
League of Legend, Dota, COH Online, Free Games on PC
Demos (multiplatform)
PC won't be completely replaced (bejeweled, farmville, wow)
Consoles are cheap, explains greater market penetration
Arcade was at the bleeding edge, replaced by consoles
Cheap Laptops, netbooks, tablets, slimline PCs flooding the market. Majority not gameworthy, can't be upgraded.
GPU war helping PC gaming, Nvidia and Amd (ati) keep pushing the envelope.
More games coming out for the PC now than in the past 3 years
Crysis 2 coming for console
TV hook up for PC not intuitive
1 xbox per child (lol)
Open Mindedness of some gamers. Pro-Gaming instead of Pro-Platform.
Blizzard hiring console programmers. Could mean PC MMO on Consoles sooner than we think
gameplay > graphics
Communal / Co-op Competition (Promoted by XBL automatically)
5.1 surround on PC vs Console
Alt Tab failing on many PC titles. Challenging Multitasking advantage.
Drivers seamless now thanks to Steam
No investment in extra graphical oomp by developers for PC due to abysmal sales
New maps (free) on PC for bad company 2  (took forever)
Very few directx 11 titles
DirectX 11 features not likely to be implemented
starcraft 2 no staying power locally
Console ports to PC is now the norm
Kinectic stuff missing on PC
Microsoft, Valve, Blizzard backing PC
Steam increase in sales 200+% growth
PC Gamers are starting to buy (is it too late?)
bluray (on pc and ps3)
Exclusive games (list major ones for each platform)
Streaming bluray content on PC (assume 1080p hd streams?)
Does netflix work on ps3/360 in Trinidad?
Seeing the technical challenges of the PC as Fun rather than problematic. Techie Mindset.
Eye finity monitor showcase
Steam library of games are mobile, can be on multiple pcs. Re-downloaded if lost/crashed.
Save games follow steam profile.
Young gamers without disposable income and access to a credit card to buy

games on steam. Piracy no longer practical for many titles because of online component. Console is cheaper and they can buy games more readily with cash making it a likely choice.
Gamers won't let their monthly investment in xbox

live/wow go to waste. Subscription model keeps them locked in.
Lack of availability of gaming pcs for ready sale in Trinidad
Techies are key to the glorious pc master race's domination.




Wii Bundle : $177
http://www.amazon.com/Wii-Hardware-Bundle-Black-

Nintendo/dp/B0045F8QDE/ref=sr_1_4?

ie=UTF8&qid=1292370111&sr=8-4

Mario Galaxy: $40
http://www.amazon.com/Super-Mario-Galaxy-2-Nintendo-

Wii/dp/B002BSA388/ref=sr_1_1?

ie=UTF8&qid=1292370149&sr=8-1

New Super Mario Bros: $39.96
http://www.amazon.com/New-Super-Mario-Bros-Wii-

Nintendo/dp/B002BRZ9G0/ref=sr_1_13?

ie=UTF8&qid=1292370111&sr=8-13

Donkey Kong Country Returns: $39.54
http://www.amazon.com/Donkey-Kong-Country-Returns-

Nintendo-Wii/dp/B003ZHMMEM/ref=sr_1_14?

ie=UTF8&qid=1292370111&sr=8-14

Total: $296.50


Sony Playstation 3

Playstation 3 160GB: $299.99
http://www.amazon.com/PlayStation-3-160-

GB/dp/B003VUO6H4/ref=sr_1_1?

ie=UTF8&qid=1292257880&sr=8-1

Call of Duty: Black Ops :47.00
http://www.amazon.com/Call-Duty-Black-Ops-

Playstation-3/dp/B003JVCA9Q/ref=sr_1_6?

s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1292257901&sr=1-6

Gran Turismo 5: 53.99
http://www.amazon.com/Gran-Turismo-5-Playstation-

3/dp/B002BSA1C6/ref=sr_1_9?

s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1292257901&sr=1-9

God of War III 46.88
http://www.amazon.com/God-War-III-Playstation-

3/dp/B000ZK9QCS/ref=sr_1_19?

s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1292257923&sr=1-19

Online Multiplayer: Free

Total: $446.87


XBOX 360 250GB $319

http://www.amazon.com/Xbox-360-250GB-

Console/dp/B003O6JJKY/ref=sr_1_5?

s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1292283252&sr=1-5

Fable 3 $39.99
http://www.amazon.com/Fable-III-Xbox-

360/dp/B002I0JGDM/ref=sr_1_1?

s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1292283539&sr=1-1

Halo Reach $39.99
http://www.amazon.com/Halo-Reach-Xbox-

360/dp/B002BSA20M/ref=pd_sim_vg_5

Call of Duty: Black Ops $47.00
http://www.amazon.com/Call-Duty-Black-Ops-Xbox-

360/dp/B003JVKHEQ/ref=pd_sim_vg_3


XBOX 360 Live Subscription Gold Card $59.99
http://www.amazon.com/Xbox-Live-Month-Online-

Game/dp/B002VBWIP6/ref=pd_sim_vg_49

Total: $505.97


Gaming PC: $671
SilverStone SG05B Mini-ITX/DTX Motherboard Plastic

Front Panel Case (Black) - US$105
Intel Core i3-550 Processor with 4 MB Cache - US$128
Sapphire Radeon HD 6850 1 GB GDDR5 - US$184
Corsair CMX4GX3M2A1600C8 XMS3 4 GB - US$75
Gigabyte Mini-ITX Motherboard GA-H55N-USB3 - US$112
Western Digital Scorpio 2.5-Inch 500 GB SATA Internal

Hard Drive WD5000BEKT - US$67

Starcraft 2: $53.99
http://www.hotcdkey.com/Starcraft-II.html

Dirt 2 : 20$
http://store.steampowered.com/app/12840/

Borderlands : 20$ Base
http://store.steampowered.com/app/8980/

Total: $764.99

[suzieboy]

I dont think PC Gaming will ever die, but right now it's in a vegetative state. There are no real innovations being made in the PC gaming sector since more and more focus is being brought to Consoles. Christ, 'kinect like' software has been around for a decade in crappy webcam games but no one pushed forward. Why? because In the end, It wouldn't be worth it.

My point exactly Mez, no real innovation but they have their flagship games...is only now PC retrying to push this 3D gaming ting and i said retry...

Who remember the days when u cudda play DOOM in 3d? u had to put on this helmet thing...lol 

[MessiaaH]

@ Mez 1300$ commnet, like u din see d post, where isme2003 built a judgement gaming pc for 600$ Playing all d modern games on high. 1300$ mite have been d price last year lol.
But prices on pc parts droping soo fast it juss retarded. 600$ for ah judgement gaming rig?
Dat is bess price. 300$ for ps3+move and ah few games, yuh already talking closer to 500$. I know ultimately d pc CANNOT win in a cost war against console. But what im saying is, you paying at LEAST 300$ for a shit netbook. or at least 400$ for ah shit pc anywass, so what is 600$ for a judgement pc. Not expensive atal in my book.


A modern gaming pc for 600$ is very very very cost effective.
And because d "BLACK OPS!" developer din put much effort into maximizing d potential of d pc over d consoles, it dont mean ALL developers doing that.
D true inovaters of gaming in d industry, is hard at work, making the pc version of their games d best, if not, pc only exclusives. Blizzard is obviously one.
ID is another -> http://www.futurelooks.com/quakecon-2010-where-pc-gaming-is-alive-and-thriving/

With big game changing players like that hard at work. I only see things gettin better, and better, and better. Not declining , hibernating, vegetating, or any of d above.

Nvidia fights back as well -> http://www.fudzilla.com/graphics/item/20314-how-nvidia-helps-keep-pc-gaming-alive

Too much money, investment, time, steaming, etc etc etc, Going into pc gaming, D industry leaders recognize d problem a few years ago, and took steps to correct it, step which we began to see d fruits of last year / this year, and going to continue to see next year, RAGE LOOKS AWESOME. It have ALOT of POWERFUL companies backing pc strong, because 1 idiot "Black OPS" do shit, it dont spell doom, not by a longshot!

Im happy to be a pc gamer, and happy to own such a beast out rig. Let the good times roll. More swet TONIGHT!

[MessiaaH]

And More:

http://pc.ign.com/articles/111/1112821p1.html

You telling me with a judgement title like this coming pc gaming dead/dying/vegetated/declining?
Yes i know it coming on console too, but ID taking extra steps to ensure d pc version is d best
Cant wait to see dis sucker on max on my rig nah, and it coming with multi too.
Quake 3 Arena all over again? EPIC!